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Do you tell people that you have dyscalculia?





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Left or Right?
eoffg
#1 Print Post
Posted on March 21 2006 12:10 PM
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Remembering left and right, is something many Members have a difficulty with. So I'd like to try and explore how we might be able to address this issue?
I have placed this under the Visual-Spatial section, as I would like to look at it in terms of this.

I would like to begin with the 2 words Left and Right?
They are sort of odd words, as their is nothing implied by the words.
If you compare them with the words Up or Down.
Where you probably dont have to 'think' about what is meant by Up or Down?
Each word has an automatic association?

This is what I would like to explore, the development of an 'automatic association' with left and right? With Members that have a difficulty with these.

Basically, I want to use both Visualisation and something called Proprioception.
For Visualisation, we want to develop some mental images in our memory, which are linked to the words left and right.

But perhaps of greater importance, is Proprioception?
As an example of this, I would use the word; Foot.
Where as you sit at your desk, I would ask you to shift your attention to one of your feet, and then simply move it around in small circles?

No doubt, you didn't have to stop and think about what's a foot, but that you immediately had a sense of its position under the table.
It is our sense of Proprioception that keeps us informed about where all parts of our body are, in space.
As another example, I would ask you to simply shift your attention to the 'Back of your Neck'?
A spot that is deprived of any attention?
Which you cant see, but you can be aware of.

So what have your Foot and Neck got to do with left and right?

The point is, that when you read the words Foot and Neck, that they have an automatic sensory association with our Foot and Neck.
No thinking is required to locate it?
This is what I'd like to try and develop with Left and Right?
Where just as the word Foot, can trigger an awareness of a foot.
That equally, the word Left has a sensory association with left side of the body, and vice versa for the right side.
So that instead of thinking about what is left and right?
That they are felt?

I would be interested to know if anyone with left/right difficulties would like to help with trying to define some helpful exercises?

Geoff.Smile
























 
mermaid23
#2 Print Post
Posted on March 21 2006 07:31 PM
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I had huge problems with this as a child. The only way I remembered it was by saying to myself "I write with my right hand."
 
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ValP
#3 Print Post
Posted on March 31 2006 02:22 PM
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Hi Geoff,
I'd be happy to help and over the moon if you come up with something to sort the issue.
I've never 'known' left from right - my late father had the same issue although I have no idea if he had dysc. too.
Interestingly I do 'know' port from starboard although the nearest I come to sailing is using an occasional car ferry.
Cheers
Val Smile
 
eoffg
#4 Print Post
Posted on April 01 2006 11:48 AM
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Hi ValpSmile,
Thanks for the reply and the offer to help. I was interested to read that you know 'port' and 'starboard'. Though on reflection, a mental picture of boat sides would support this.
Though right and left dont have such a singular visual image.
Also with the english language, the fact right and left have alternative meanings; 'I left right after he did.' Only adds to the confusion.

Though I would really appreciate your help in developing some simple exercises to develop an automatic, 'sense' of left and right.
As I mentioned earlier in this thread, the aim is use our 'Proprioception' sense, which is the sense that makes us aware of all of our 'body parts'.
For example, if I ask you to simply lift and drop one of your feet.
When you thought of your feet, you didn't have to think about where your feet are. Rather you have a 'sense' of your feet.
Their was no confusion with your hands, or any other body part?
Where equally, I would ask you to simply; lift and then drop your hands on the table.
Next, simply lift and drop your feet, then lift and drop your hands.
No doubt, you automatically located your feet and hands when you did this?
Their was no confusion between Feet and Hands?
Just as feet and hands are 2 extremities of the body, so are left and right. Where the aim is to develop an automatic body sense of left and right, in the same way that we have of our feet and hands.
So that instead of 'thinking' of left and right, that we automatically 'sense' left and right.
Perhaps you could try these simple exercises and let me know whether it made sense to you?
Geoff.Smile

PS;I hope that you dont kick yourself?



















 
ValP
#5 Print Post
Posted on April 02 2006 12:03 PM
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Hi Geoff,
Yes, it makes perfect sense. The port / starboard thing is instinct, there has never been an image associated. I look to port without being aware of processing the instruction in the same way 'lift a foot' causes an almost automatic action.
Here's something interesting. I've just asked my son - a 21 yr. old 'normal' - what happens in his head if I say "look left" and it turns out he visualises the corridors in his primary school - right is where the classrooms were.
My partner Rob -also a 'normal' - has just asked how do we deal with east & west, nearside / offside in a car and 'clock' bearings - bandits at 10 o'clock.
My son suggests some sort of repetitive game, they were drilled in bow, stern. port & starboard by having to run to the appropriate scout hut wall. Wrong wall & you're out, hesitate & you're out, last one there and you're out. Last man standing gets bragging rights.
My gut feeling is that the left / right conscious thinking process needs to somehow become a 'hind brain' automatic process - like when you have been driving a car for a while, gear shifts & steering are automatic leaving you to concentrate on the other maniacs behind their wheels.
So : visualisation, repitition, physical movement, competition (therefore adrenaline). Where do we go from here?

Cheers
Val Smile
 
eoffg
#6 Print Post
Posted on April 03 2006 09:36 AM
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Hi ValP,
Thanks for replying to this, as it is a most interesting issue?
Where as you write, it needs to become an automatic process, or rather response. Like driving a car, which uses something called our Non-Declarative Memory.
You ask, where do we go from here?
Where you suggest: visualisation, repetition, physical movement, competition (therefore adrenaline).
Perhaps some sort of combination of these?
Though I'm thinking that a physical approach would be more effective than visualization? As visualization is a slower mental process.
Than a physical response? Where I would return to my previous post about proprioception and our ability to automatically sense our feet.
Whereas to visualise our feet, takes much longer.
So rather than visualising left and right, it would be more effective to 'feel'/ sense left and right?
Where simple physical movement and repetition would seem to be the best approach? Accompanied by vocalising the words left and right.

So I'll look into this a bit more, and then get back to you.
Geoff.Smile

















 
Kehawin
#7 Print Post
Posted on June 23 2006 12:56 AM
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I had this problem as a child.

"You write with your right" didn't help, since I was ambidextrous until first grade.

What finally helped me was the AHA when someone said, you hold your hands up, and the one that makes an L is Left.

Leave it to associating a letter/word, instead of a fine motor skill, to make the light bulb go off for me!

I still had a problem sometimes figuring it out QUICKLY until I joined marching band. After a month of reminding myself "downbeat is always THIS side" I was able to FEEL left and right much better... to the point of winning "drill downs" all the time in HS (Drill downs are a Simon Says sort of marching band game... the command is given, and you don't GO until the HUT is given. Throw in some cancel the lasts, and double to the left flank, triple to the right slide HUTS, and it gets difficult.)

However, to this day, I have problems with pictures/live people vs mirror images. If someone shows me a picture and says look at the ring on her left hand, I don't automatically know which hand to look at.

I think repetitive physical movements is a great idea for working on this!!
 
Kehawin
#8 Print Post
Posted on June 23 2006 01:08 AM
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double post sorry
Edited by Kehawin on June 26 2006 02:27 AM
 
Countess
#9 Print Post
Posted on June 23 2006 12:29 PM
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Grin Kehawin
If you look into the Parents-Corner here http://www.dyscal...ead_id=116 thats the way my child did it and it still works Pfft

Countess
'You should really be sympathetic to people who suffer 'Normalism' (Geoff)
My Child (born 97) has Dyscalculia
Sorry for any spelling mistakes ;-)
 
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dawn
#10 Print Post
Posted on September 19 2006 10:08 PM
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My son has dyscalculia age 6 not me but I want to point out that I only learnt to remember my left side after I got my bcg jab age 12 in my left arm .ie I have no sense of left and right... Also I have weak visuo-spatal skills..no sense of distance or linking places up in my head....driving with a map involves stopping after the 3rd road on the left and checking and then stopping after the next manoeuvre. So my point is this can be a normal weakness..(women are known for bad visuospatial skills)...are you over medicalising this.. nb I know I am in denial still about my son and I am seeking get out clauses!!!
 
TheatreLvr08
#11 Print Post
Posted on September 20 2006 05:16 PM
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Oddly, I never had trouble with left or right. But this is possibly because I'm left handed, so I always remembered "left" as the hand I wrote with and "right" as "the opposute hand". No, really, it makes sense in my brain, LOL. I think most people have trouble with left and right, though it may be more severe for some dyscalculics. I never had a problem, though.
~Rachel~

I love to act, sing, and dance.
 
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ert
#12 Print Post
Posted on September 20 2006 10:18 PM
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TheatreLvr08 wrote:
Oddly, I never had trouble with left or right. But this is possibly because I'm left handed, so I always remembered "left" as the hand I wrote with and "right" as "the opposute hand". No, really, it makes sense in my brain, LOL.


I could never use that, because I use both hands for everything. I'm not ambed....uh, I can't spell that, but you know what I mean. At least I don't think so - because I can do some things the right way with one hand, and not with the other. I catch balls with my left hand automatically, but when I write, it's the right hand.
 
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Krash
#13 Print Post
Posted on September 21 2006 11:50 PM
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when i play a sport, i can tell which is my left hand or right hand because my left hand is really weak if i use it. it was automatic. i didnt have to think about it. but during other times, like going to my classes, marching band, general coordination, i have no clue which is which. i tried recalling it once, but i might was well had sang "O Canada" on the moon without oxygen because i couldnt remember which hand was weaker. and i do remember, it either took me too long, or forget not too long after that. I guess the only times i will understand it is if im not really "thinking" about it. now that i think about it, i also have trouble with up and down, tho not as severly.
Edited by Krash on September 21 2006 11:51 PM
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dnab eht nioj =B
 
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ladybug
#14 Print Post
Posted on October 29 2006 09:35 PM
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This was a problem for me forever. When I was a child my father used to write L & R on the tops of my hands in black marker to try to remember. I had a fellow dyscalculiac who was also dyslexic teach me a trick.
I wear a ring. Its my left hand ring. I wear it all the time. Its the only ring i wear on my left side. Most of the time i dont wear any other rings period (Only on special occasions, when I can be more relaxed about L/R issues)
When I am asked about L/R it has become automatic to "feel" the ring and go from there.
 
conquest
#15 Print Post
Posted on November 28 2006 12:17 AM
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I've never had the problem of left and right confusion. However, it may be a good idea for someone who does to use a magic marker and apropriatly mark your hands with "L" and "R". If it's not embarassing to you, go that way for a while until it sinks into long term memory.
 
alena schmitt
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Posted on December 07 2006 06:20 PM
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after trying all the usual right and left tricks. my parents put a sticker on my left forarm (it was a haeret) and made sure i had it every time i went to play then eventuallly i had a tan line so every time im confuse i look down at wrist and heart will show me the way!
 
gooup
#17 Print Post
Posted on December 07 2006 06:43 PM
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Funny, this is one symptom i don't have. i count myself lucky (for once).
 
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Freda
#18 Print Post
Posted on December 09 2006 10:29 PM
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alena schmitt wrote:
after trying all the usual right and left tricks. my parents put a sticker on my left forarm (it was a haeret) and made sure i had it every time i went to play then eventuallly i had a tan line so every time im confuse i look down at wrist and heart will show me the way!


Awesome Grin
 
Laura
#19 Print Post
Posted on December 09 2006 11:59 PM
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I use to work in a cash office and when we were checking the ATM machines we use to have to do the combinations, this was terrible as it was always left, right, left and then right again and the other machine was right, left, right and then left. My friend and i only ever go it once each as we were shocking at it and in the end had to get one of the senior cashiers to come in and help us. The last time we did it the store manager opened his section and then had to open our section as we so couldnt do it.

When learning dance routins which is really never as i so cant do that either i just totally mess up anything to do with moving left or right or turning and moving left or right this is even funnier if you are slighty tipsy

Learning to skate is a no no too as i just havent mastered the whole manovering thing just yet

walking in a straight line is a no no too just cant do it and like the dancing its hilarious when i have been drinking.

I just dont care anymore as this is who i am and no-one is gonna change it but it is weird when all my friends mock me cause of my groovy styles of alll the above
 
mmmaybebaby
#20 Print Post
Posted on December 21 2006 02:41 AM
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I am actually getting an "L" and an "R" tattooed on my left and right foot, respectively Smile

In general I understand left and right, and I know that my left is my left, and my right my right (if that makes sense), but when it comes time to apply that knowledge, I get all mixed up, especially if the action is repetitive. I can't do the same thing over and over and over correctly.
 
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